Thank you all for your comments and for sharing your experiences today. It was great to hear from people working directly, and the methods you're using. We're closing the discussion on experiences but we'll be back tomorrow discussing the challenges and barriers migrant learners come up against when accessing and completing adult education programmes. 

Dear friends, I would like to thank everybody for the numerous, extremely informative and insightful comments. It appears to me that language education (in many variations, from L2 to L1 to multilingual education) is currently dominating the practical activities both of NGO's and the policies and practice of official institutions. VET seems to be less urgent right now at least for newly-arrived immigrants. But this may change soon, let us see what tomorrow's discussion says.

Also, another perspective emergend in today's discussion: the whole thing is not only about educating migrants for language and integration (which can never be imposed) but about educating societies to live in a continuous process of immigration and even transmigration.

Thanks again, and I wish everybody lots of energy and optimism in their work - and a very nice evening. 

I would like to raise one other, rather different aspect, of education that builds meaningful living together for migrants and their host communities.

The fact that a core part of the narrative change around this topic, is the fact that we need to have education also directed towards host communities, so linking more with awareness raising and increasing the capacities of host communities in terms of their knowledge, their understanding, and practical skills to engage with migrants. Most migrant education is done with migrants as "beneficiaries" (I don't like the term) ...global education in schools (and we have seen there that it is still done not enough and doesn't engage enough the parents) or sometimes tokenistic (food and music) cultural attepts to make the population aware of their backgrounds, which DO HAVE a strong impact and value but need to be followed up with the right structures and cultural value change.  

The programmes having migrants and host population together developing and educating themselves about each other and about competencies needed in our world are still few....it happens more from informal (when people get married....for example)....to nonformal ....and very little to the formal setting. perhaps this is what we could address as a challenge and opportunity tomorrow?

Speaking on the Romania experience, the approach is that migrants have the same rights as Romanians, thus beyond language training, they should be able to access VET programmes as any citizen of Romania does.  Now that is also to say that they have as little chances, as Romanians to enter meaninful VET programmes. Generally, the focus on VET in Romania is being reduced, and this is a criticism I bring to the educational system, that trains many theoreticians, that keeps people in the educational system "just to study" and to prolongue the moment when they are faced with the challenge of not finding employment.

The same applies for migrants, and from personal experience and accounts I have met many migrants for whom education (schooling) is the option of engagement into the new society, or even the reason for migrating. So, a look at meaningful VET and better counselling to enter the labour market is essential. For example more linking between LEGAL CLINICS for migrants (such as the ones in the Netherlands) and advocacy efforts towards National and European Education Programmes.

Hello, 

My name is Dominique Millet. I am working (voluntary) in the association AIFRISSS. With the INSUP- Bordeaux, my association draw an Erasmus + project named DIME (Development of a skills reference framework and a training modules to promote the Inclusion of Migrants in Europe www.projetdime.eu). The referent is INSUP.

I enter very late in the discussion, excuse me.

Concerning the language training, there  is, in  the democratic states of Europe, who recieved much migrant people, a convergence : all states think and declare that the knowledge of the language of the host country and a multicultural education are the greatest conditions of  inclusion. But, it is very difficult to know what is the best manner to learn a second language in the situation of "migrant " or refugee. Somme universities in differents countries began to develop researches on the subject : Language of Integration. I think it would be interesting that the different researchers exchange their own results on this subject. Is that possible ? Can EPALE realize this work ?

Dear participants in this discussion, we had quiter a long excursus on multilingualism and intercultural education in schools. Thsi is related to adult education, because teachers and parents (migrants or not) are adults. We also received several interesting examples of national strategy (Norway, Romania, Croatia...) and of local programmes (Italy, France, Germany...) highlighting what is done in adult education for immigrants of different ages and origins, with different motivations for miugrating and learning (or not).

Now, for the last part of our discussion, may I draw your attention again to the main focus of this day, namely experiences in the field of adult education of immigrants / refugees.

Questions and issues that might be discussed:

- Beyond or beside language courses, what is offered in terms of vocational education and training (VET)?

- Are there problems in recognizing and accepting qualifications earned in other countries?

- Is citizenshipo education (intercultural dialogue, integration contents...) offered as part of VET programmes? In what terms?

- Any specific programmes for women? With facilitating structures like childcare?

- Transition to the labour market?

As a moderator, please allow me to contribute to our discussion with two links related to Germany:

http://www.ki-koeln.de

http://www.bamf.de/DE/Willkommen/DeutschLernen/Integrationskurse/integr…

http://dhwv.de/kausa/

Hi again, everybody! I have written a short blog article on new trends in the Norwegian approach to this field of training, and it has just been published. It may provide more food for discussion. Have a look: /en/blog/migrant-education-new-trends-norwegian-approach

Looking forward to reading your comments!

Regarding the language support I would like to share with you all Policy brief produced by SIRIUS Network for Educationg Children with Migrant Background that focused on how to prepare national language strategies that will be adressed to immigrant students needs. Also there are some examples of good practises that could be very useful.

Referring to Andrea Tanase and to other comments on the importance of teaching or at least welcoming the mother tongues of immigrants: In the present discussion, I think in all member states (provided they welcome and have immigrants at all), the main or only focus is on teaching the language of the receiving country, and facilitating integration. However, as we know from research and experience, teaching or at least not discriminating the mother tongue(s), is equally important for language development (in children and youth), and for feeling accepted (in everybody). And multilingual education (for every citizen) was declared as a goal by the European Commission in 1996 already!

According to comparative studies and to periodical surveys published by the EC and by the CoE, attention to languages is unequally developed in Europe. Some of the comments indirectly witness or confirm this state of affair.

It would be nice to get more comments and information on projects which aim at a more comprehensive approach to languages in connection with migrants.

I am not a teacher, but I am married to a Ghanaian and my children have always looked different in a Maltese school. Although my children are Maltese and have grown up in Malta and speak perfect English and Maltese, I have met several teachers who have struggled in how to deal with this subject, even moreso because of the presence of my children. 

Although the curriculum is produced and given to teachers I have encountered two challenges in the course of my children's education. First, most teachers mean well and really desire to address cultural diversity in a responsible, ethical and positive manner. However, even if they understand the curriculum, it is hard for a teacher who has never even set foot in Africa for example, to use the curriculum and their personal experience to bring convincing arguments in the classroom. I know that sometimes in my children's case there were one or two teachers who have felt inadequate, if not threatened, at times, because of lack of personal experience and exposure.

Another problem is that teachers may truly have their own prejudices to deal with.  Sometimes my daughters explain to me that very rarely could the teacher understand where they were coming from, even though their mother was Maltese. At times they were expected to be vulnerable, and when they showed themselves to be confident, they were seen as overconfident. One of my daughters tells me that  although they are not migrants, they feel they are in the same 'limelight' , and that they are exhalted as saints when they do good, or punished as criminals when they err. 

Although we are treating the subject of adult migrants, these examples show that systematic solutions often have shortcomings because of their top down approach. In order to generate true solutions, one needs to have a participatory framework, and bring migrant representatives and educators to the table. The schools cannot do it alone, but theyneed the whole community in a win-win situation. Wouldn't it be more beneficial for example to teach intercultural dialogue in a school where the local council or municiality organised a cultural event where the migrant and local communities both showcased their products? Wouldn't it be more beneficial to teach this subject but develop mentoring networks between parents at te same time? If children learn to separate curricula from life, we will just repeat a sad story.

Hello. My name is Andra Tanase and I m both working as a peace building practitioner and education researcher and practitioner.

Noting the various challenges, that will be more explored in the coming days, I would like to give a brief insight into Romania's realities regarding migrant education then also introduce the perspective of Multilingual Education.

Romania is still one of the countries with relatively low number of migrants. In a nutshell, while minority education system is well developed, very little and close to nothing is done when it comes to migrant/refugee education. Migrants who come to Romania as expats, or business people have access to quality private education, and often contribute to initiating such educational projects (international schools) whereas the migrants with a lower level of financial resources and refugees have little support in this sense. They have basic access to Romanian language lessons, but even that happens mostly on paper and in a very formal manner. There is no system of encouraging migrant teachers to be formed and enter the educational setting. Thus the few initiatives come from civil society. one of the more successful such initiatives is the "cultural mediators" project, where migrants are trained as society mediators, ensuring the access and support for other migrants access to education, health services etc..

MLE, education in several minority and international language, at the same time, seeking to increase not only linguistic competencies but also social capital in diverse communities. This type of education has been  We at PATRIR (Romanian Peace Institute) have engaged with this model mainly in Ukraine first in Crimea and now through a pilot at a national level, but this concept lis implemented around the world. The reason why I would introduce this model, is the fact that such a model could actually create a prevention framework for conflicts that are likely to occurr when migrants join a certain community.

Building upon the fact that migrants come into the new community with a strong, yet shaken sense of their identity, with a new identity component that of a migrant, speaking one's own language and at the same time acquiring the language of the community is very important. If this is done inclusively, in recognition of all langauges spoken into a community, and without the separation of learners into different communities, the social cohesion effect is substantial. MLE represents also a valid entry point for dialogue, as school is indeed an enviroment where students are open, are desiring learning. The engagement of the community to be aware of the model, is essential. Then the spill-over effects are real. So parents informed about what their children will learn, the benefits of multilinguism, parents on board with the process will be themselves open to take the message and reality of multilinguism and multiculturalism. THe same applies for local authorities and media. 

To pilot and implement an MLE programme, a few key aspects are essential: policy framework, capacity building for teachers and educators, material and financial resources, community awareness and buy in and constant research along the process.

For more details on our piloting together with the Ministry of Education in Ukraine, please check the following video:

Thanks Roberto, for this quite interesting insight. I was wondering about the situation in Germany after the unprecedented influx of immigrants and the government-declared effort of not repeating the past mistakes. In your words, I feel the situation with financing the immigrant education is far more confused than anticipated. It would be interesting to compare this with other countries like Sweden which also has hich immigrant influx currently.

Thank you, Roberto. Indeed, Germany has a complicated and flexible, yet sometimes confusing system due (or thanks) to the federalist structure; but also, this must be acknowledges, a quite developed offer of language and vocational training programmes. Developing a national strategy is difficult not only because of federalism, but because of political divergences between the ruling parties, and between them and the opposition. 

Also important is the point you make about the language learning problem with old and new immigrants. The real difference, I agree, is not so much due to the ancienneté of the single migrant, but rather to the motives which lead a person to migrate, the level of education, and the accessibility (costs, enough courses available, information).  And let's not forget the gender gap.

Hello everybody, my name is Roberto, and for the last couple of months I have been responsible for a specific programme directed towards migrants in my hometown Göttingen. I am currently employed by the Volkshochschule Göttingen, a college for adult education with a good record on projects for migrants and other groups targeting the job market.

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A few sidenotes first. And sorry up front, if I am stating the obvious here for everyone ;) but I want to make sure that the specifics of our project are visible within the context.

1) I have been working in the field of adult learning since 1999 and through diverse experiences always had the opportunity to test my teaching skills with both newly arrived and long-term migrants in a variety of topics (from computer skills through social and intercultural skills and towards job opportunities on the German labor market). Regarding my approach as a teacher it made next to no difference, for how long foreigners lived in Germany - Language was always the key regarding understanding and later their potential on the job market.

2) However, teaching German as a foreign language (DaF) is regulated. You can of course use one of the many community colleges (and other language schools) based in nearly every city with a population from about 5.000 upwards, but then you´ll have to pay for it. If you are unemployed, usually the Employment Agency will not finance direct language trainings, only in connection with job market orientation. (so-called §45 projects)

The other way is, if you are an acknowledged migrant or refugee - in that case you´re entitled for the so-called Integration Training with 600+ hours of German and a few hours on basic "citizenship education".

3) With so many refugees coming to Germany particularly in 2015, the country faced (both on higher political as well as communal level) a huge a) opportunity and b) challenge. Regarding a), we can clearly avoid the mistakes made in the 60´s when many Turkish men (and later their families) came to Germany for better job options. The integration of these into the German society never really worked out as planned (if indeed it ever was planned?) and even their grandchildren still face many obstacles and exclusion today. That should be a warning, and on the surface it seems both the politicians and civilians (generally, apart from some narrower minded individuals) understand this opportunity.

As to b), the challenge is that the political map in Germany is strongly divided regarding responsibilities, money distribution channels and authorities. There is a level for country politics (in Berlin), there are the states with their own ministries and there are communities with their own Employment Agencies setting up the projects. You can say, that the money flows for refugee programmes from the top (Berlin) since Mid 2015, but how quickly, what kind of money and for which kind of projects lands in the communities, is quite difficult to follow. Many organizations, and not just for adult education are "jumping on the train" now in search for those Euros from Berlin, which makes an assessment of "what works - and why -, and what doesn´t" even more difficult. It seems that for the moment they are spraying money (scattergun approach) over the country hoping that most of the money will go into fitting programmes - and leave the assessment for calmer times.

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With this setup, I´d like to explain now how and why our little project "ABuD" (Mobilization, Job orientation and German for Migrants) was set up. But to confine myself in this box, I´ll do this in the next comment :)

Greetings from Croatia!

My name is Eli Pijaca Plavsic and I work as an Executive Director of civil society organisation Forum for Freedom in Education. We are mostly working with teachers by providing in service teacher training programmes with different topics based on teachers actual needs. From 2011. we sterted to work on education of children with migrant background as a part of EU Network SIRIUS.

Let me explain the situation with migrants and asylum seekers in Croatia.

Croatia has been adopted some general measures of the minorities, migrants and asylum seekers integration in the educational system showing  awith developing  laws and documents showing the country (especially as a new EU country) has strategy as well. Since the start of the negotiation process with the European Union (EU) in October 2005, Croatia has made considerable progress in migration reform on its path to EU accession. Migration legislation is in place and, to a great extent, harmonized with the EU acquits. However, there is still a need to improve cross-border and regional cooperation in the area of labour migration.

According to the Law on Asylum, asylum seekers are entitled to residence in the Reception Centre for Asylum Seekers, provision of basic living and accommodation facilities, health care, elementary and secondary education, financial support, free legal aid, humanitarian aid, the right to work, and freedom of religion and religious upbringing of their children.Nevertheless, issues have arisen in relation to access to education. Although the Law on Asylum (Article 32) prescribes that asylum seekers are entitled to elementary and secondary education under the same conditions as Croatian nationals, and that this right should be made available within three months from the day of submission of the asylum application (or within one year in cases where the asylum seeker is not familiar with the Croatian language), there have been some problems in practice. Due to the lack of programmes for learning the Croatian language, different approaches and standards are applied to a minor asylum seeker of school age: those who are from neighbouring countries and speak a language similar to Croatian are sent to school, yet this is not the case when the asylum seeker speaks an entirely different language. The Law on Upbringing and Education in Primary and Secondary School under the jurisdiction of the Ministry of Science, Education and Sports, is the most important legal basis but there are no special provisions and measures regulating integration into the educational system.

As far as the practise is concerned there is no systematic approach in educating children of migrant background or asylum seekers. There are some projects and initiatives coming from different stakeholders mostly coming from civil society organisations The biggest challenge in terms of intercultural education and respecting diversity will come with the full implementation of the National Framework Curricula and current Curricular reform. Effective and successful educational process needs to be inclusive, interactive and based on the intercultural values. When designing an appropriate system, the focus needs to be on the 3 equally important areas: interaction of children of the refugees, asylum seekers end migrants and interculturalism in schools, language courses for adults and availability of tertiary education for refugees, asylum seekers and migrants which inevitably involves some knowledge of previous qualifications of the person.

Hi, I am working with diverse migrant groups in Malta and I have found that learner-focused strategies usually need to be multiple, at times some more focused than others, and also require creativity. The organisation I work for, FSM (Foundation for Shelter and Support to migrants), has conducted migrant education programmes within an open centre in Malta for 5 years. However there has always been an element of flexibility based on the requirements of the learner. Some learners simply required a reference to an institute of vocational or higher education; others required very focused interventions that address the basics of literacy. 

I think it is important to have open, accessible, low cost programmes open to everyone. However, especially for the very vulnerable, focused strategies and programmes need to be facilitated, and these require some work with pedagogy as Odile has pointed out.